Thanks, Winn, for a thoughtful post emphasizing treating all as image-bearers. Yes, just laws. Yes, enforcement. Yes, to treating all as we would want to be treated.
Winn, Love your writings, mine is a little different this time. Yes to just laws and enforcement. It gets messed up when the laws are not followed. Most follow a process to come into our country and they want a law abiding people to see that they want that, too. We didn't get to where we are by running amuck in our country and doing what we think will fit in. Our ancestors followed a plan. Heaven follows a plan and has a gate. We have to follow the directions and a will to want to belong to a Godly Family. We haven't found the right way to make all this earthly mess to be more civil. I keep on praying and reading the Words. We want to follow the right Way.
Hi, Jean, I'm always glad for you reading, especially when you disagree. I simply want the laws to be truly just and the enforcement to match the offense. So much of what is happening right now is not just and the enforcement does not match the offense. May we indeed follow the right way.
Poignant, friend. To a tee. Your *tenderness* toward those being undignified and abused and shot to death. Your *theological-ness* (Romans 13 excursus) toward us Jesus-followers who live in the kingdom of God and also live in the American story. There is (to say it out-loud) a large swath of the American church in radical need of re-thinking their Caesar and God categories. And then your *thoughtfulness* toward the political-cultural discourse behind this Administration's immigration policy: indeed, it does befuddle, this fiction, this "energizing idea controlling much of the narrative." Of course, on this particular matter, as you must know, the arguments don't really matter; it's the fiction that sells.
There is nothing really that I disagree with in your comments. Yet, when documenting intricate thoughts with written words - the absolute intent, the between the lines is a challenge. Thanks for taking a shot (not literally!)
I do not think that there are many Christians who applaud or are not sad about violence and killings etc. And, yes, it is also sad to understand that millions, billions around the globe are hungry for a better life. This is the fallen world that God still loves. So, unbiased empathy must be our approach,. The world is unknowingly under the control of the evil one, most all people are spiritual POW's and dont' know it. People are blind. But now we.
It does appear that many feel compelled to lovingly take the side of all immigrants, illegal or not. Yet, perhaps there ought not be sides. At the wedding feast, the one not rightly clothed was kicked out and killed... oh my! I know this is more of a story speaking to our only avenue in to Heaven bing Christ Himself...But is did come to mind as I was considering these thoughts.
I was hungry....so I stole...I was broke so I stole...I killed because I felt hurt.....Can't we empathize with the lawbreaker as we still execite justice? If we overlook lawlessness - does the law matter?
THe incidents of violence - all sides - the death and destruction are all bad and most agree...And yet, we also sort of 'proudly agree or we feel compelled to join those who are actually protesting the enfocement of the law......The USA is not 'christian' entity - it is a country. Perhaps I should, we should feel come conviction with regard to the global Church not taking care of those they live amongst. Disagreeing with how the law is being enforced is Not unChristian - not is agreeing that the laws whould be obeyed....ALL of this - All of most everything in this fallen world is meant to divide and distract family of God and we ought be more shrewd to recognize this...... BTW I doubt there will be any borders in Heaven..what do you think?
Thanks for reading, Thomas, and for getting out your thoughts. I'm not sure I completely follow everything here, but what grieves me is how many of us actually don't seem genuinely sad. I see a lot of defending and hedging. Of course, people will disagree on right laws and how they should be enforced -- but as Christians, we always must insist on compassion, especially when we're talking about civil issues such as crossing a border without the right papers. But indeed, the USA is not a Christian entity, nor would anyone mistake us for one.
And no, I can't imagine a border in heaven. We're all around the Great Table together. I want a little more of that now.
It is an honor and encouragement to be in direct communication with you. I love you and have benefitted from your writings. You don't know me, but I am also sensitive and now hoping you did not feel offended by any of my freeflowing thoughts.
I will tell you that I am genuinely sad -- overwhelmingly sad as I observe the poor, the neglected, the rich, the addicted the hopeless, helpless and hapless not inly within this immigration challenge but in all areas of life. I am sad, so sad but not surprised. They know not what 'they' do...we are not blind, we see.
I think, living in the NYC I've become concerned that 'we' tend to want to be loved and agreed with, who doesn't? We want to fit in...and in NY area we want people to think we are open enough to watching MSNBC vs Fox!! And, I suspect to appear this way, we trend to adopt/agree with current thinking....'we' tend to be influenced, if not compromised vs us influencing others. The emphasis on love- which is a good emphasis - sort of covers over all else....Abortion is a good example: Don't you love the young mother? Most abortions are found in the impowerished community - don't you love them? etc.
In this current amped up environment around immigrations we are forced to take sides or prove who we are supporting. Yet, maybe we should take no sides and support all sides.....Is it right to be unduly rough and tough with those who have entered illegally? Of course not- we are against that. Is it right to enter the country illegally? No, we are against that. We support upholding the Lord while treating people with love and respect.....There is right and right and wrong and wrong...
Enough said....Do we really want to see things change? Yes we do. Well then let's go and make disciples who take the time to sit in His Presence and actually get to know Him and thereby become more and more like Him. Then, just be being our transforming selves...the world changes. TG
a fitting and timely exegesis of Romans 12:14. Thanks Winn...
thanks for all the thoughtful commentary here,
Points well made. I particularly find the footnotes insightful and instructive. Thank you. I am with you in hope for tears
Thanks, Winn, for a thoughtful post emphasizing treating all as image-bearers. Yes, just laws. Yes, enforcement. Yes, to treating all as we would want to be treated.
Thank you, Winn.
Great article Winn. It’s so easy for my heart to become so hardened with anger to the ruthlessness of what’s happening that I become tearless.
We'll help each other regain our footing.
Winn, Love your writings, mine is a little different this time. Yes to just laws and enforcement. It gets messed up when the laws are not followed. Most follow a process to come into our country and they want a law abiding people to see that they want that, too. We didn't get to where we are by running amuck in our country and doing what we think will fit in. Our ancestors followed a plan. Heaven follows a plan and has a gate. We have to follow the directions and a will to want to belong to a Godly Family. We haven't found the right way to make all this earthly mess to be more civil. I keep on praying and reading the Words. We want to follow the right Way.
Hi, Jean, I'm always glad for you reading, especially when you disagree. I simply want the laws to be truly just and the enforcement to match the offense. So much of what is happening right now is not just and the enforcement does not match the offense. May we indeed follow the right way.
"Rediscovering our tears will require our refusal to abandon another’s humanity, refusing to ignore their belovedness in the eyes of God."
I read it all and felt deep longing. This particular sentence stood out to me. Thank you, Winn.
Utterly brilliant. Well done. And thank you!🙏🏻
We are all witnesses at some level . We count on pastors and people w a 30,000 foot view to give us words and hope we are all moved
to make changes as best we can. Am intention is never enough a prayer without action is half way there
Thank you so much for this, Winn. You put words to what I have been ruminating on these past days and weeks.
beautiful. true. a deep hearted reminder to lean into loving, always.
thank you, Winn.
much needed now
Thank you. Crying and praying with you!
Poignant, friend. To a tee. Your *tenderness* toward those being undignified and abused and shot to death. Your *theological-ness* (Romans 13 excursus) toward us Jesus-followers who live in the kingdom of God and also live in the American story. There is (to say it out-loud) a large swath of the American church in radical need of re-thinking their Caesar and God categories. And then your *thoughtfulness* toward the political-cultural discourse behind this Administration's immigration policy: indeed, it does befuddle, this fiction, this "energizing idea controlling much of the narrative." Of course, on this particular matter, as you must know, the arguments don't really matter; it's the fiction that sells.
it sells bigly
There is nothing really that I disagree with in your comments. Yet, when documenting intricate thoughts with written words - the absolute intent, the between the lines is a challenge. Thanks for taking a shot (not literally!)
I do not think that there are many Christians who applaud or are not sad about violence and killings etc. And, yes, it is also sad to understand that millions, billions around the globe are hungry for a better life. This is the fallen world that God still loves. So, unbiased empathy must be our approach,. The world is unknowingly under the control of the evil one, most all people are spiritual POW's and dont' know it. People are blind. But now we.
It does appear that many feel compelled to lovingly take the side of all immigrants, illegal or not. Yet, perhaps there ought not be sides. At the wedding feast, the one not rightly clothed was kicked out and killed... oh my! I know this is more of a story speaking to our only avenue in to Heaven bing Christ Himself...But is did come to mind as I was considering these thoughts.
I was hungry....so I stole...I was broke so I stole...I killed because I felt hurt.....Can't we empathize with the lawbreaker as we still execite justice? If we overlook lawlessness - does the law matter?
THe incidents of violence - all sides - the death and destruction are all bad and most agree...And yet, we also sort of 'proudly agree or we feel compelled to join those who are actually protesting the enfocement of the law......The USA is not 'christian' entity - it is a country. Perhaps I should, we should feel come conviction with regard to the global Church not taking care of those they live amongst. Disagreeing with how the law is being enforced is Not unChristian - not is agreeing that the laws whould be obeyed....ALL of this - All of most everything in this fallen world is meant to divide and distract family of God and we ought be more shrewd to recognize this...... BTW I doubt there will be any borders in Heaven..what do you think?
Thanks for reading, Thomas, and for getting out your thoughts. I'm not sure I completely follow everything here, but what grieves me is how many of us actually don't seem genuinely sad. I see a lot of defending and hedging. Of course, people will disagree on right laws and how they should be enforced -- but as Christians, we always must insist on compassion, especially when we're talking about civil issues such as crossing a border without the right papers. But indeed, the USA is not a Christian entity, nor would anyone mistake us for one.
And no, I can't imagine a border in heaven. We're all around the Great Table together. I want a little more of that now.
Hey Winn-
It is an honor and encouragement to be in direct communication with you. I love you and have benefitted from your writings. You don't know me, but I am also sensitive and now hoping you did not feel offended by any of my freeflowing thoughts.
I will tell you that I am genuinely sad -- overwhelmingly sad as I observe the poor, the neglected, the rich, the addicted the hopeless, helpless and hapless not inly within this immigration challenge but in all areas of life. I am sad, so sad but not surprised. They know not what 'they' do...we are not blind, we see.
I think, living in the NYC I've become concerned that 'we' tend to want to be loved and agreed with, who doesn't? We want to fit in...and in NY area we want people to think we are open enough to watching MSNBC vs Fox!! And, I suspect to appear this way, we trend to adopt/agree with current thinking....'we' tend to be influenced, if not compromised vs us influencing others. The emphasis on love- which is a good emphasis - sort of covers over all else....Abortion is a good example: Don't you love the young mother? Most abortions are found in the impowerished community - don't you love them? etc.
In this current amped up environment around immigrations we are forced to take sides or prove who we are supporting. Yet, maybe we should take no sides and support all sides.....Is it right to be unduly rough and tough with those who have entered illegally? Of course not- we are against that. Is it right to enter the country illegally? No, we are against that. We support upholding the Lord while treating people with love and respect.....There is right and right and wrong and wrong...
Enough said....Do we really want to see things change? Yes we do. Well then let's go and make disciples who take the time to sit in His Presence and actually get to know Him and thereby become more and more like Him. Then, just be being our transforming selves...the world changes. TG
You did not offend me at all, Thomas. Bless you today.